Why are my photos noisy - discussion

noooOOOh.......I think there is more to it than that 🙂

Sure. I have doubts, however, about the efficiency. The math says that averaging noise by multiple frames is with the square root of the number of shots. You need 4 shots to half it, and then you have only one stop.

Some compact cameras do this. The one I tried it on (I believe it was the RX100) was not very efficient.

this is my little yacht i built when i was 25 and i built the house its getting lifted over when i was 22. my big yacht i built at 33.

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same on my old Olympus cameras. my a7r2 single shot was much better in every way than hi res. i got banned for posting a comparison and from there they never ended.

Maybe it is, maybe it isn't. I have no reason to believe it is. That photo could have come from anywhere. So the obvious question is "So what?"

It's just another fairy tale tangent as described earlier and nothing at all to do with this thread 😊

You know how. Arguing about offtopic and authorities. It has nothing to do with OP.

This is unnecessary. I did. And it is what it is. More than couple of threads now full of arguing, accusing, name calling, reputation damage, offtopic, flame. That´s not what users expect. Some agree with my statement, some come to my DMs to discuss just that. It is awful, and It is quite alarming that support team actually "supports" that. Awful realisation.

@MikaY They might need to get a life. Yet, terrible....

I agree. Despite the great potential there could be in two extremely different but also clearly capable and intelligent individuals arguing and going back and forth - this is not only a bad look for the two people involved, but also a little bit for the site as a whole.

Not a dealbreaker (for me), but I think it might prevent at least a couple of people from staying here or even signing up.

its friendly banter./intense debating and presenting facts. arguing is far from these discussions. some are just provoking for me to disclose my pro photography sites. but that's not going to happen. i PM my links if i think a person is worthy to see what i shoot.

I think the less oppressive environment here compared to the old site is refreshing. So people bicker. Let them. As long as it's kept at a reasonable level I don't have a problem. I can skip threads I get tired of.

It also prevents some people deliberately trying to rally moderators by starting fights in threads/subjects they know the moderators don't like, and getting the threads closed. I've seen that a lot.

Here is an article from Sony which pretty much has it right in terms of correctly differentiating exposure* and image lightness.

www.sony.com/electronics/support/articles/00267925

The article starts off with:

"Exposure is the amount of light coming into the camera when shooting a photograph."

which is very similar to - amount of light that struck the sensor per unit area while the shutter was open.

It then says:

"The amount of light is determined by the aperture and shutter speed."

which should really also include scene luminance. The important thing to note is that Sony say that ISO is not part of the exposure as they define exposure.

They then go on to say:

"These, combined with ISO sensitivity, determine the brightness of a photograph."

which is effectively what I and many others have been saying in that ISO is an image lightness, not exposure*, parameter.

Therefore this article from Sony also confirms what I posted earlier:

For a given scene lighting:

f/8, 1/400s, ISO 200

and

f/8, 1/200s, ISO 100

will output the same image lightness (or brightness if you like) but the ISO 200 shot will have had only 1/2 the exposure* of the ISO 100 shot and so the ISO 200 shot will have more visible noise than the ISO 100 shot.

The bottom line here is that Sony are saying that according to their definition of exposure, exposure is not how light or dark an image looks.

* exposure - amount of light that struck the sensor per unit area while the shutter was open
** optimal exposure - the maximum exposure* within dof and motion blur requirements without clipping important highlights.
*** under exposed - more exposure* could have been added with the DOF and blur constraints still being met without clipping important highlights.

exactly. it will settle down, everyone is just letting loose after such a long period 7 years of moderation on DPR . in any case how long can one discuss the most simple processes of photography "exposure" noise and iso. at least there's been no brand bashing, trolling and equivalence. when its all settled down the threads should be deleted and start all over again.

@JohnA: Can handle that. Just voiced my opinion. The worth of it might be zero, or it might be not. I don´t know. I am aware of that balance. Can´t have the cake and eat it too.
@DonaldB: Presenting facst goes long way, and can be spam still. Sky is blue -well, what does it have to do here...
It would be nice to find what the topic claims to be, not hundreds of OT posts. That´s about it.

ISO Sensitivity
In digital cameras, the ISO sensitivity is an indicator to show how much the light coming from the lens is amplified in the camera.
The amount of light coming into the camera is determined by the aperture and shutter speed. From this amount, the light is amplified to create a well-exposed image. The ISO sensitivity represents the level of this amplification numerically. For example, ISO200 is twice as sensitive as ISO100. This means that adjusting the setting to ISO200 lets you shoot with the same brightness as ISO100 even in half the amount of light.
Actually, in most modes, the ISO sensitivity is automatically determined by the camera according to shooting conditions. However, in the P/A/S/M-modes, you can also set it manually depending on your needs.
As the sensitivity gets higher, you can use faster shutter speeds even in low-light situations to reduce blurs caused by camera shake under low light or subject movement in sports shooting. However, because the light is amplified electrically, shooting with the high ISO sensitivity tends to result in more noise (grain) or loss of sharpness on the photograph.

You post very few facts. Even Sony say that exposure is not how light or dark an image looks, where you claim it is, according to the article I linked to earlier 🙂