• March 18, 2024, 6:49 p.m.

    OK, of course it's complex because it's taxation. I found an information sheet that says how it works. It comes from Florida Revenue, so it should be legit. It says:

    *Market (or Just) Value: The property appraiser determines the market value of a parcel based on market activity prior to the assessment date.

    Assessment Differential: The property appraiser ensures that annual value caps, established in the Florida Constitution, are applied to the market value (no
    more than 3% increase for homestead residential property and 10% for commercial properties).

    Assessed Value: The property’s market value with assessment differential for annual value caps applied

    Exemptions: Reductions in property tax owed based on applying and qualifying for the exemption (e.g., homestead, military/veteran, etc.)

    Taxable Value: The property’s assessed value with exemptions applied *

    So let's be clear here. What we are talking about is here is 'Market (or Just) value. That is the property appraiser's opinion of the market value of the property. The assessed and taxable value are irrelevant to this discussion. I can find nothing that suggests other than it is an experts view of the market value - that is what the property would sell for. Another expert's view might be different, but a difference of 2,300% between them sounds unlikely. And it is, because the whole point is that this is not a case of two assessors coming to different conclusions about the same item. They were assessing different items. The tax appraiser was taxing a property on which there was a deed restrictions which meant that its only allowable use was as a private club. This results in a market valuation in which the market is only those wishing to run a private club. The bank assessors were given the value for, and assessed the value for a property with no deed restrictions, which could be used as a private residence, a hotel, split into condos or anything that they wanted to do with it. Such a property would sell into a much larger market and thus its market price would be much higher. Thus those higher valuations were fraudulently applied, because the deed restrictions were omitted from the loan applications and assessors' information.

    No. They were both market values. It was simply that one valuer was valuing a property with deed restrictions and the other wasn't. So he did incriminate himself.
    As I said, there was a pattern of fraud. In the case of the Trump Tower apartment the tax valuer was valuing a property with 1/3 the floor area of the property that the loan valuer was valuing. It's a simple, straightforward and evident fraud.

    You don't get to decide on the legal remedy. It's the law that does that and the judge has to apply the law. However, good for Trump that you aren't the law, because your penalty would mean him losing something that is apparently worth $612M, whereas the judge only penalised him to the extent of $354M, so you would have been $258M more punitive than the judge was.

    Let's look back at this thread, where you said

    This attitude (though legally incorrect and irrelevant to a case where no-one is being charged with theft) seems to be somewhat at odds with what you've just said. Let's write it in the same language

    See the contradiction?
    The problem for you is that whilst theft is not an issue in the documents case, fraud in an issue in the NY case, and the laws under which the Trump organisation is charged do not require that anyone be harmed for the defendant to be liable. You might not agree with the law, but that is the law. So unfortunately it's no defence. Trump and his organisation have been tried according to the law, found liable according to the law and would expect to pay the penalty that the law prescribes.

  • Members 695 posts
    March 18, 2024, 6:53 p.m.

    I don't know the people who make the standards, but my feeling, based on the material, is somewhat the opposite. That is, they can to xxxx well enough to be experts in xxxx, but are detached from the reality of the students who are supposed to be learning xxxx. That is, it's all easy if you already know xxxx, but more than a little problematic for people learning xxxx.

    In my opinion, the idea behind Common Core is sound: to move away from the instrumental toward the conceptual. That is, to teach math in a way that students are able to understand and reason mathematically as opposed to turning them into human calculators, where the latter serves no purpose, whatsoever, because, well, we have calculators that can do this stuff (to include algebra and calculus) better than a human can.

    But, the reality of Common Core is quite different from the idea behind it -- not unlike the reality of communism in the world today as opposed to the theory behind it. Texts mix up all sorts of different maths in an incompetent attempt to show connection when all it does is spray a disconnected series of dots on a piece of paper and ask students to make sense of it. Then they teach more elaborate algorithms to solve certain problems thinking that the more elaborate algorithm breeds understanding when, in fact, its merely more difficult to remember all the steps and implement over the traditional algorithm.

    That said, for a great deal of math, it's taught the same as when I went to school, and that's problematic, too -- no progress is being made. I remember arguing with a professor a long time ago about his idea that students should be allowed to use calculators in school. I couldn't understand his reasoning -- how does that make things better and not worse? I couldn't let it go, so I talked to him after class. He said, "You see, your students are doing the same math you did. Why? They should be doing much harder and more realistic problems than you did, and using the available technology to help them solve them." So my mind was caught in anti-calculator mode because I thought he was talking about having students solve the same problems I did without a calculator, but let them use a calculator. Instead, he was saying that the students need to be challenged to think more with harder problems and use technology to deal with the drudgery of computation.

    And this leads me to "cancelling" the times tables. No where did I see that memorizing the times tables was bad or thrown out. But it is deprioritized in the new framework. That is, there is more value for students to learn that 12 x 13 can be computed as (10 + 2)(10 + 3) than there is for students to memorize the answer, and I fully agree with this notion. In fact, I would take things so much further, bringing everything back to "What's the point of learning math, anyway, if computers can do it all for us?" Mathematical instruction needs to be based on answering that question, and as such, there needs to be a radical shift in how math is taught. But change on that scale is difficult to implement for many reasons, not the least of which is that many of the teachers probably can't reason mathematically (they're caught up in their own instrumental education).

    Ironically, an excellent example of mathematical reasoning is the SAT test (a college entrance exam) that is being phased out, since studies have shown that SAT results have little correlation with university performance, which makes since, and that's another related and important discussion to have. I've long believed that the kinds of math and strategies to solve SAT problems is much closer to the conceptual understanding math that is currently being taught. I explain to my students all the time how the math on the SAT is easy -- if they are solving a problem and it's hard, then they're solving a different problem than was asked (reading comprehension) and/or solving it incorrectly. The GRE, GMAT, Praxis, AP Calc, et al, tests are all excellent, in my opinion, in testing one's mathematical comprehension skills better than these critical skills are taught in the schools, which is why so many struggle with such easy tests.

    Man, I can really go on quite a bit about this, so someone say something. 😁

  • Members 599 posts
    March 18, 2024, 7:39 p.m.

    How am I not surprised, but then again, I assumed you may have thought he got off lightly and should have been incarcerated for life, or even executed...pffft.
    This whole case is fraudulent against Trump and thankfully the majority of the public see it for what it truly is...political persecution.
    When folks call out the law for being an Ass, this would be another befitting example of it.
    The Democrats have lost sight of their political moral compass and are dragging the country into ruination in order to stay in power indefinitely. Lawfare and State weaponization is not the way to do it.

  • March 18, 2024, 7:45 p.m.

    One time I was running a programming practical class. One of the students came up to me and said 'my computer isn't working'. I asked him to show me what was happening. Each time he ran his program it exited with an error message. I asked him to show me the program. It was something of a revelation to him that the problem might be his program. Anyway, I found the offending line quite quickly, he was dividing by zero.
    I said 'there's your problem'.
    He looked at it and said 'There's nothing wrong'.
    I said look harder, he looked blankly, so I asked him what would be the value of the two variables. He correctly worked out that the divisor would be zero, but still couldn't see the problem.
    'What do you get when you divide a number by zero?' I asked. Again, that blank look.
    I asked him what you got when you divided 1 by 1. He knew that. Divided by 0.5. He got that. He followed it down to 0.01 gives 100. I hoped he was seeing the pattern, but I took no chances.
    "See, the smaller that you divide the number by, the bigger the result", I said, "so what happens when you divide a number by zero?"
    He looked completely blank, the suddenly a look of revelation came over his face. I thought he had got it.
    He took his calculator out of his bag and entered "1÷0=", looked at the result, and said to me with a look of triumph on his face "e".

  • March 18, 2024, 9:12 p.m.

    Irrelevant. Both valuers were valuing market value. They were given different information which materially affected the valuation. The tax man valued it on the basis of deed restrictions preventing its use for anything but a private club, the bank valuers that it was free of such restrictions and could be used for anything.

    It is explained in the ruling starting page 81.

    So, if you see a disclaimer in the fine print you assume that you're being defrauded? Anyhow, thankfully the court found that the 'worthless clause' is worthless as a defence, and this ruling was upheld on appeal - as it should have been. Adding 'I might be telling you lies' doesn't make one immune from being charged with fraud. Imagine how that would work if generalised. If you told someone you might shoot him it would be his responsibility to get out of the way and when you actually did shoot him you couldn't be charged with murder. If you told someone you might burgle his house it would be his responsibility to prevent you doing so and if he did burgle him you'd get off scot free. It's a nonsense. And my analogy is spot on. Sorry about that. It just exposes the double standard.

    Trump's running on prosecuting immigrants (among other things). Does that mean that were he elected any prosecutions of immigrants would be invalid? I'm not sure that I agree with election of partisan attorneys general, but that's what happens in the US. No point complaining about it. Plus, she's only doing the job she's required to do in NT Executive Law § 63(12) (fully explained starting pp2 of the ruling).

  • March 18, 2024, 9:34 p.m.

    Clearly not, because this was a civil case and did not allow for either of those penalties. I quite like the idea of the law as it stands being applied as it stands. It would definitely be a bad idea if execution was added to the list of remedies in a civil case.

    I don't think so. The poll I could find gave 50% think he's guilty, 24% think he's not and 25% don't know. That accords pretty well with the results for the other cases researched by YouGov, which is one of the more neutral and reliable polling organisations. The problem is that as you might expect, Democrats overwhelmingly think he's guilty, Republicans overall think he's innocent, but independents tend to guilty - enough to give 'guilty' the plurality.

    Your opinion, but the case has followed the law, so far as I can see.

    You said earlier that politicians who commit crimes should only be prosecuted depending on political affiliation. Given this opinion, I would guess that means that you think they shouldn't be prosecuted if they are Republican. Doesn't seem to be a sustainable position to me. To my mind the question is has Trump committed crimes or not - and the purpose of the justice system is to determine whether someone has committed crimes of which they are accused. In the American justice system it's not possible just to undertake a political prosecution - a grand jury has to be convince that there is a case to answer first. The main mistake that the Justice Department has made is foot dragging. They were scared enough of the narrative that you're giving that they delayed the best part of two years before properly investigated. Let's be clear. Fraud should be and is a crime and fraudsters should be prosecuted. Trying to change the results of an election (apart from due process) should be and is a crime in a democracy, and people that do it should be prosecuted. In the other NY case, Trump is accused of the same crime for which his accomplice has already been tried, found guilty and sent to gaol.The concept behid law is quite simple:
    1. There is a set of laws.
    2. To convict a person of breaking a law the prosecution has to present evidence that they broke the law.
    3. If the evidence presented does not prove that they broke the law they are found innocent.
    Of course, nothing is perfect and miscarriages of justice do happen - but since in these cases we have not got to stage 3 we cannot say whether or not that might have happened.

  • Members 695 posts
    March 18, 2024, 10:10 p.m.

    I call BS -- my daughter never took one of your classes. 😁

  • March 18, 2024, 10:14 p.m.

    LOL.
    The thing about it, it was a scientific calculator, so he had e right there on the keyboard, beside π

  • March 18, 2024, 10:18 p.m.

    How do you know if they are illegal if you don't prosecute them?

  • Members 599 posts
    March 19, 2024, 6:05 p.m.

    This is nothing short of a political witch hunt and abuse of the legal system. It is pretty evident that there is a two tier system of justice. This best sums up what is happening:
    twitter.com/AlinaHabba/status/1758590976786858008

  • March 19, 2024, 6:48 p.m.

    You keep on saying, you don't show why.

  • Members 695 posts
    March 19, 2024, 8:37 p.m.

    Do your own research, Bob. 😆

    By the way: www.rawstory.com/trump-carroll-rape/

  • Members 599 posts
    March 20, 2024, 5:15 p.m.

    You and I are not in the court room, nor are we lawyers. The court documents don't tell the whole story, especially when it is a partisan biased scenario.
    Lawyer Alina Habbas's succinct statement accurately sums up this atrocity. It reflects my opinion before she even announced it. It is despicable [but not surprising] that this kind of lawfare and deep state weaponisation is taking place. It is even more disgusting when the lamestream mediaturds are democratic propagandists supporting this nonsense. True journalism is dead. Can you say Banana Republic...?